Posted by Rambler in AskRamble (edited )

You may have noticed I've not been around a whole lot lately. I've touched base on the reason why in another post but didn't go into great detail and will still be somewhat vague for the sake of some privacy.

I've been busy helping care for a member of my family, working, and picking up some slack in their household. Long story short, after a couple of weeks in the ICU, this person passed away. That's just life.

But here is the strange thing: I work a normal blue collar job. I work alone, and usually just spend 8 hours every day just sort of in my mind, thinking about things, and enjoying not having digital stimulus around (the internet, my phone, etc). It's sort of therapeutic in a sense and a good digital detox, similar to going for a long drive, a hike, or just a walk.

Some time into my shift, a sort of strong feeling came over me. I got a bit cold. I started to think of this person who has been in the ICU and I just felt that they passed. It's hard to put into words what exactly I felt but it was significant enough that I wrote the time down on my sweaty arm to document the experience and I continued to finish out my shift as normal.

While this family member has been in the hospital, I've been helping take care of things at their house and I got off work, and drove straight there to take care of the dog and what not before I'd come to my own house to rest for a bit before doing it all over again. I get there, and see that their wife is home and not at the hospital staying with him so I knew that it was likely he had passed while I was work. I go inside, and she tells me he passed. I asked when, and the time she gave me was the EXACT time I wrote on my arm, to the minute. I got goosebumps and raised hairs over the whole ordeal.

I told her she wasn't going to believe this but took my jacket off and showed her and told her what I felt at work and thought something had happened on my end in order for me to feel the need to write that down as some sort of proof that I knew, but I didn't really know.

So, it got me thinking. What the fuck did I just experience, exactly?

I'm not a religious person at all. So after some time to collect my thoughts and wrap my head around the loss of a close family member, I've come to determine that what I experienced was one of the following:

1.) Something supernatural or spiritual. A final goodbye, of sorts. OR

2.) Similar to how twins are connected in a way that it's been reported that one twin has known when the other one is in danger or in trouble thousands of miles a way. Some sort of strange human connection occurred where I felt the pain and grief of the surviving relative who I am very close to as that time struck and she watched him flatline and die. That somehow seems more likely than the above, even if science can't really explain it OR

3.) None of the above. I just had too much time to think, my mind started drifting towards morbid thoughts and I just figured he died and for some odd reason, out of normal characters for myself, I stopped what I was doing to document the time by writing it on my arm. Perhaps it was just a series of minor coincidences and I'm overthinking the event.

What do you think?

Do you believe humans are connected in a way that allows for those who are very close to one another sense someone else's pain, even if you're somewhere else (miles away)? Do you believe in spirits and supernatural things, that a passing family member might be able to say 'bye' to those that they cared about? Do you think things like this, that people report, is just a matter of coincidences and a sign of mourning/loss and nothing more?

4

Comments

You must log in or register to comment.

AWiggerInTime wrote

First of all, my condolences. I don't really know what to say more, the loss of a loved one is always harsh and hard to get through.

Secondly, I do know people from my family and outside who experienced a very similar/exact same thing. Is this a proof of existence of the spiritual world? Who knows. I try to not think too much about it, it's very easy to get lost in deliberations for hours and it is kind of scary. We humans don't like the unknown.

Though I have to admit, events like this do add some mysticity to our otherwise pretty well documented world.
3

burnerben wrote

death is a complicated thing. i dont think any of us fully understand it until we are gone. im personally atheist but i like to think about my lost loved ones looking down on me from the heavens. but as far as that feeling you experienced i had the same thing once. my mothers side lives in a slavic country and i often spend summers there. when i had left after my month to go back home to america i was sure i had said goodbye to everyone, but i guess i hadnt said goodbye to my great grandmother and great aunt. i knew it was a mistake and i had an immense fear i would never get to see them again and i had forgotten to say goodbye. fast forward 3 months or so my great aunt passed away. i had a similar feeling to what you may have described but i brushed it off as nothing because how would i know my great aunt would die. touching back on me being atheist, even though i do not believe in god i do believe there is a spiritual side to life. i believe many interpret that as god, but i see it just as an equal flip side of science or fact. so maybe that is why. but i suppose we will never really know. all we can do is ramble on.

2

riddler wrote

Sorry for your loss.

I've heard several stories like yours, and I believe what happened to you was real. There is obliviously a evolutionary advantage to knowing when one in your group dies. We know many insects like ants and bees have a well understood way of communicating about the death of one of their own. Humans being a higher level animal are harder to understand.

Another commonality in these stories tends to be that few and usually only one family members tend to experience this phenomena. Maybe you are a uniquely perceptive individual. Maybe you were closer than you realize to the person who passed. Maybe the person who passed wanted to thank you personally. Either way, you should be honored to be a part of it.

I've never been religious or spiritual person, but I've recently started feeling that what I can only describe as evil exists in my world. Hopefully what you got to experience was the opposite of that.

2

DoubleRubber wrote

To start off, it's probably best if you throw this away and don't read it, because you probably don't want to know how this works. "Foreknowledge is the flowering of the Dao. But it is the flower of folly. The wise man takes the fruit, and leaves the flower!" But if you must...

Every sentient organism experiences two related phenomena: free will, and qualia. These two things are temporal inverses of one another, and they both result from precognition. Picture a machine can read a ticket with a number printed on it, and print out a ticket with the same number a minute before. If you take the ticket you got out of the machine in the past, back into the machine in the future, you create a loop. No law of physics says what to put on the ticket. No random numbers are generated to decide the value. Yet there is a value. Where does it come from? Outside the universe. It is a boundary condition. When you do it that way, it's free will. But you could also resolve to write your own number on the ticket. You get a ticket out of the machine that matches your number. Then you put either ticket in the machine. That's qualia. You are taking information out of the universe that goes into the loop. This is I/O for the universe, basis of sentience.

Now normally people don't suffer from precognition in their daily lives. Why? Because it's dangerous. And it causes all kinds of annoying little syndromes. The things that stick out are bad things - like someone dying - and if you see them before they happen, maybe they happened "because" you saw them. Note causality is bunk - there is only one future - yet which universe we live in is the result of free will as we experience our other dimension of time moving through the parallel universes, but I digress.

Some free thinkers may get the unfortunate notion to try to suppress the repression mechanism in the brain that stops them from remembering the future. (It is just like remembering the past in operation) Additionally, judging by massive gyrations in the economy, QE, Covid, Hong Kong suppression etc., I am suspicious that some of the people raising brain organoids (fetal brain like things up to 200 days old) are trying to use them to play the market, with predictably awful results. (I don't know that)

Any kind of "magic" or "psi" is a manifestation of precognition, without exception. Dowsers can't dowse if you don't eventually tell them if they were right. And telepaths who think they are getting a message from someone at a certain time have simply remembered hearing the time, and been affected by it when they saw it was actually that time.

The precognition end of the loop is like memory, but it can be painful from excess blood flow. That isn't affected by the emotional importance of the memory but by its technical complexity. Like a "training" method is you try to pull out a result from a search engine using four words that have nothing to do with the search term. Picking the right file out of a million files ... ouch. The retrocognition end feels like a sort of drunkenness. You get this weird sense that you are hallucinating something into reality. Because you actually are.

Paranoia is a defense. You precognition fear very well, and if you remember being afraid you'll get hit by a stray bullet, that competes with the risk you really are, which reduces the notion that you're a walking magnet for pulling something like that in at yourself. Or increases it, in terms of perception.

When two preaks get together, they can do a thing called psiduel where they start weirding each other out. The loser should look at the sky, first thing created or something, I mean, it seems soothing somehow.

Precognitive feedback is when there is a congruity between past and future. Like, you just miss a shuttle bus, and you remember the next time you'll miss it, and ... before long, you literally miss it by a few seconds every single time you go at it, without exception, because past and future are all mixed up.

Precognition is hard to cure entirely. Main method I know has to do with the Diocletan Persecution. It turns out that Christians making the sign of the cross can interfere with precognition. NO idea why that should work, but you may in fact find it effective.

If you are in the mood for a different and seemingly less hazardous psi excursion, try looking outside the frame in your dreams. Our free will comes from comparison between very similar parallel dimensions along the chain of creation. When you dream you're getting chased by a monster, you may actually be sensing thoughts from your parallel-dimension self who is watching that as a movie. Sometimes you might get a bit during the day. You're never far from your self in the parallel dimensions! Try to take down the music, make notes on the architecture... in this era of Covid, the most memorable movies I've seen lately were in a parallel universe. :)

2

onion wrote

Rambler, I came back here to read the new posts and noticed that the way I phrased my previous post was insensitive. It could be read to mean that I think you might be lying or delusional so I'm sorry about that. I believe you and your post really made me wonder how it could have happened

TBH I do have doubts about the friends and family who have told me about paranormal experiences though. In every case, they have either been very religious, having mental issues, or both. Not that there's something wrong with being religious, but I think in general religious people are less likely to look for natural explanations. And even good religious people have an incentive to lie or exaggerate sometimes because they are trying to literally save souls from eternal torment.

The guy who told me about seeing the sign in the form of an animal was very religious and also once told me that he has five or seven personality disorders or some number like that. I have religious family members who report experiences with ghosts and demons. I think they were probably hallucinating and/or misinterpreting noises.

I brought up the credibility issue because I'm guessing you are similar to me, in that you've heard of paranormal events from other people before but weren't convinced enough to start believing yourself. Obviously, someone close dying while you're not there with them is not a good experience at all. But I think for skeptics, there is a positive side to experiencing something which is hard to explain. There is probably a basic human need to believe in something more, but if you are a skeptic who has only had ordinary experiences, it can feel irrational to search for it.

2

onion wrote (edited )

I’m sorry to hear that. It’s great that you were there for them near the end. I’ve heard of stories like this. My old friend said that he got a sign when someone in his family passed. I think he saw some animal or something which he took as a sign and then it turned out that the person had died.

I’ve always hoped that some unusual experience would happen to me so I could experience it firsthand. When hearing about paranormal experiences second hand, even from trusted friends and family, I always have to acknowledge the possibility that it’s a delusion or lie or that there is more to the story. Or of course that it’s a coincidence. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" and all. People die and have accidents regularly. When no one predicts it, no one notices that no one predicted it. Also, when people get a feeling that something bad happened or will happen and then it turns out to be nothing, people don’t take note of that either. Only when someone has an unusual feeling AND something happens does the story get passed around. But it’s great that you thought to jot down the time. Most people don't think to do that. Now you have stronger evidence that it wasn’t a coincidence. It must have been really interesting to the doctor you showed as well.

I think it could be a combination of coincidence and science. If you saw this person earlier in the day, or the previous day, you could have subconsciously picked up on cues that they were doing worse than before. The subconscious mind can be much better at figuring things out than the conscious mind. Many victims of violent crime describe having had a bad feeling about the perpetrator prior to being attacked or prior to getting in a romantic relationship which later turns out to be abusive. Often the feeling is brushed off because it seems unfounded and irrational.

You could have picked up body language or something about how they were breathing, or something about their voice. Maybe even a smell. So lets say your subconscious picks up on the fact that they are going to die in the next 24 hours (just throwing a number out there since I don’t know how accurate the subconscious mind is). 24 x 60 = 1440. 1/1440. So you’re probably going to get the feeling that they died at some point since your subconscious picked up on the likelihood earlier. Then you have a 1/1440 chance of getting it on the exact minute. Even if you didn’t get it on the exact minute, it probably would have registered as a remarkable event.

That is the most likely naturalistic explanation I can think of. But if you feel like what you experienced was more spiritual or paranormal in nature, then that is very understandable. If I had that experience, I would probably become more interested in exploring spirituality and religion. The mainstream scientific view is that psychic abilities are pseudoscience, but scientists do not fully understand how consciousness works or what it is, so they can’t claim to know everything about how one consciousness can interact with another consciousness. Some philosophies say that everything is one consciousness. I’m guessing Buddhist monks understand more about the nature of consciousness than most scientists who study it.

You may be interested to read about Operation Stargate and Grill Flame. The CIA was studying psychic abilities for years- mainly remote viewing. Apparently the results in the lab were statistically significant but the program was still not useful enough for them to continue. What you are describing, where two people have an emotional connection and one dies… that is a harder thing to study and there is not the same national security incentive that would encourage lots of research on it.

The foregoing observations provide a compelling argument against continuation of the program within the intelligence community. Even though a statistically significant effect has been observed in the laboratory, it remains unclear whether the existence of a paranormal phenomenon, remote viewing, has been demonstrated. The laboratory studies do not provide evidence regarding the origins or nature of the phenomenon, assuming it exists, nor do they address an important methodological issue of inter-judge reliability. Further, even if it could be demonstrated unequivocally that a paranormal phenomenon occurs under the conditions present in the laboratory paradigm, these conditions have limited Executive Summary American Institutes for Research E-5 applicability and utility for intelligence gathering operations. For example, the nature of the remote viewing targets are vastly dissimilar, as are the specific tasks required of the remote viewers. Most importantly, the information provided by remote viewing is vague and ambiguous, making it difficult, if not impossible, for the technique to yield information of sufficient quality and accuracy of information for actionable intelligence. Thus, we conclude that continued use of remote viewing in intelligence gathering operations is not warranted.

https://fas.org/irp/program/collect/air1995.pdf

1